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Proper (meaning valid and semantic) Markup and CSS, Please.

I love this forum package but while it has tons of things (including the forum itself) that make it different from every other forum package out there, it has one thing in common - horrible semantically incorrect markup and CSS (although not as bad as the markup). I understand I am a new member here and my comment may come off as arrogant or rude but that is not my intention. I would like to create a couple static HTML pages of the index and topic view page. I haven't looked through the markup or styling in great detail but I can already see many things that should be changed for this forum package to be as complete as it can be as of this point. If my suggestions and static HTML mock ups will go unused, tell me so I don't have to waste both our time. However, if you will listen to my suggestions, I don't mind helping at all since Vanilla has such great potential.


  • Yeah it isn't perfect, and there are certainly some things worth changing (body vs .Body vs #Body, unnecessary blockquotes on the account page, etc), but in general it seems to be pretty good.
  • Um, massive amounts of div abuse =/= good. Semantic elements, which generally lead to less CSS, are lacking here.
  • personally i think this sounds like a good idea. i would definitely offer up some help in this nick should you need it.
  • I have no doubt that mark will be willing to take your suggestions on board - especially if you ran through the css files and turned them into what is considered proper and semantically correct then send them to him. Probably worth having a word with lech too as he's done a lot of the cleaning up where css is concerned.
  • Send some suggestions over to Mark. Also, take into account that for a forum that is extensible, it isn't bad if there are extra divs. A plugin may use them. And ofcourse anyone can create his/her own theme with superb html/css if needed.
  • Oh, I know. I plan to leave room for expansion. I mean, when you use divisions like, <div class="BannerContainer"> <div class="Banner"> <div class="BannerLogo"><a href=""><img src="extensions/LussumoBanner/lussumo.logo.gif" alt="Lussumo" /></a></div> Which really only needs (Plus perhaps a span other methods of FIR), <div id="banner"><h1><a href="link" title="title">Site</a></h1></div> you can see how a clean up would help. I wouldn't mind it if either mark or lech contacting me via IM (or have me contact them) to show/discuss the clean ups.
  • MarkMark Vanilla Staff
    Get the svn of the forum.
    Make your changes to the templates and the css.
    Send it over to me so I can see that it works in all browsers.
    I will implement.

    I've been asking for this for (literally) years from the community, because it is not my strong suit. And you are the first to step up to plate.
  • You will have to forgive me - SVN? SubVersion Number? I can only test limited browsers... I am confident it will display equally on, IE5+, Opera 7+, FF x.x.x +, Safari (most recent version -1), Camino, Konqueror (Most recent version -1),
  • MarkMark Vanilla Staff
    Vanilla 0.9.3 is currently only available by SVN (Subversion).
    If you don't have any idea how to install and set up subversion, I will send you a zip of the site from my local copy.
  • MarkMark Vanilla Staff
    I've got to get to work, so I just zipped and emailed it to you at Revision 177.

    I will hold off on any fixes that involve the templates until you are finished.
  • Ok, thanks.
  • MarkMark Vanilla Staff
    edited January 2006
    Oh no. If you can pull this off, the thanks go to you :)
  • hey nick send me the url to the version of vanilla you get going for cleaning up these templates and css and i'll help you out.
  • great idea here. if you all need any more help from a CSS guy, let me know.
  • edited January 2006
    Sure. I will get home tonight and start with skeleton CSS/HTML.

    The way I like to work it is,
    1. Clean up the markup or clear it and start again. This is complex however since it requires certain elements/IDs for the javascript to work. I shall probably have to just sanitize it.
    2. Clean the CSS. Again, since the javascript requires certain things, I will probably append them to the file (since last declaration takes effect).
    3. View the original CSS and attempt to recreate it using my own method(s).
    4. Start testing!
    With that, perhaps the people who are interested can help by each of us "cleaning" the CSS and see what works best/is the smallest/etc?
  • sounds like a plan. it will be good to get some collective heads together on this.
  • sounds good. but i think i'll just watch :-D
  • edited January 2006
    Um, massive amounts of div abuse =/= good.

    Semantic elements, which generally lead to less CSS, are lacking here.
    I agree. Too bad that HTML is completely missing any sort of semantic replacement for the tags in question.
  • Great initiative, if you guys need any help whatsoever let me know. I wouldn't mind taking a crack at this, I love doing these kinda things...
  • I won't be able to start this until Thursday (tomorrow) or later Friday due to some things that came up in school. However, if you want to co-ordinate and/or talk about what is going on, we could all do it over IM or in a certain CSS Beauty IRC channel ;)
This discussion has been closed.